鈥溌槎勾� Talks鈥� hosts top professionals from different sectors of the lumber and building material industry to share their expertise, with a heavy emphasis on practical, tactical strategies to help you serve your markets and grow your business.
In this episode of 麻豆传媒 Talks Credit, Thea Dudley shares multiples ways to respond when a customer ghosts you. There鈥檚 persistence, mechanics liens, Little Miller Act, small claims court, and more.
If you鈥檝e ever gotten ghosted by a customer right when you need them the most, you鈥檙e not alone. Tune in to learn new strategies for handling this situation.
Contact Thea with your podcast related questions, comments, and/or ghosting stories at听thea@creditoverlord.com.
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Prefer to read about it instead? Take a peek at the transcript below.
(Editor鈥檚 note: Transcript is AI-generated and may include some errors.)听
Thea Dudley听
This episode of 麻豆传媒 talks credit is sponsored by PWT, and at PWT, you get more than an engineered wood supplier. You get a true partner who鈥檚 ready to support your success, coast to coast, and that鈥檚 something they鈥檙e willing to shake on.
听
Thea Dudley听
Hey there. I鈥檓 Thea Dudley, also known as the credit Overlord, and welcome to 麻豆传媒 talks credit. We are the only podcast that talks trade credit and the lumber and building material space. Never miss an episode. Stay tuned, and we鈥檙e glad you鈥檙e here.
听
Thea Dudley听
Welcome to 麻豆传媒 talks credit. I鈥檓 Thea Dudley, your host, also known as the credit Overlord, and today we鈥檙e going to talk about ghosting, specifically getting ghosted. Now, as a credit professional, you already know what I鈥檓 talking about. These are the customers that never return your calls, texts, emails, smoke screen, whatever. They suddenly do not know you. They also were the customers that when you were considering opening their account or increasing their credit line, could not pay enough attention to you. They could not have been nicer, more accommodating. You call, text, email, they were spot on. They were emailing you back. Hey girl, what do you need? And then you fast forward about 30-40, days, and no money鈥檚 coming in, and suddenly this fool doesn鈥檛 know my phone number, doesn鈥檛 know how to text, can鈥檛 email, doesn鈥檛 know anything. Suddenly I am. I鈥檓 just I鈥檓 invisible. It doesn鈥檛 even know me. It鈥檚 like the start of a really great relationship, and then suddenly it鈥檚 like, what happened? I thought we were getting along famously, and now suddenly I鈥檓 here with no money. Reach out to my salesman, Thea, he鈥檚 been getting your messages. Seriously? He鈥檚 gotten all of them. He鈥檚 just so busy. He is so so busy. Doesn鈥檛 even hardly have time to do anything. He said he鈥檚 going to get to you, he鈥檚 going to he鈥檚 going to call you. When will I be dead? Will I be retired? Will it be before the end of the year? Will it be before I run out of lien rights? When is this wonderful customer going to honor me with a return? Phone call, text, email, you don鈥檛 want to talk to me, that鈥檚 cool. Text or email me. Every credit manager I know has this happen at least weekly. I鈥檇 like to say it鈥檚 a yearly thing, but it is absolutely a weekly thing. There鈥檚 always somebody making bad choices, because it鈥檚 always a bad choice not to take a credit manager phone call. I don鈥檛 care if you don鈥檛 have anything good to tell me, at least talk to me and then we can, as adults, decide what we鈥檙e going to do with this account without you communicating, I have to make decisions without you. So if you鈥檙e going to ghost me, I鈥檓 going to talk about some ways to, oh, I don鈥檛 know, you know, maybe haunt you back, or set something up so that you didn鈥檛 have the opportunity to pull this. Some of these are going to be obvious. Some of them maybe not as obvious, but should be, and some will be long shots and obscure, but always worth an opportunity to see. Who knows, maybe you鈥檒l get lucky on the super obvious side of things.
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Thea Dudley听
We鈥檙e talking about, mechanics liens. Nothing gets someone鈥檚 attention as fast as filing a lien on their project, because now the owner knows I never get so fast a phone call from a GC as when that lien hits. They鈥檙e super pleasant. They鈥檙e so fun. Usually there鈥檚 some yelling and screaming involved. You know, at least you鈥檙e talking to me. I can listen if you鈥檙e going to yell and scream at me. I鈥檓 going to go ahead and put you on hold until you can calm down. I鈥檝e already filed the lien. You had a chance to talk to me, and you blew me off. Now I know in some states, you鈥檝e got to serve the preliminary lien notice, and you might be out of bounds on that hopefully on these accounts, that maybe you had a gut check factor, or you鈥檙e like, we鈥檒l go ahead and take a chance, but we鈥檙e going to take a chance and use our lien rights. Those are the ones you鈥檙e going to be able to that鈥檚 a not that I advocate, mean of spirit. But if you鈥檙e going to leave me with little options, I鈥檓 going to go for it.
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Thea Dudley听
There鈥檚 also little Miller act. And Miller act, that鈥檚, if you鈥檝e done federal or state jobs. Usually this comes into play when it鈥檚 some account that you know, bless their heart, they just were not big enough of a company to take on some of these large projects, and financially, they just weren鈥檛 able to handle it. Now they鈥檙e using everybody else鈥檚 money to do it. I. Be mine, my company鈥檚 and we鈥檙e funding it unwittingly. I did not ask to fund your project. This is a short term loan, so if I can file on the bonds for Miller or little Miller act, absolutely going to get on board with that. Yeah, I like payments and performance bonds for GCS, they鈥檙e going into a project. Usually it鈥檚 not to stock their warehouse. Usually going into, like, Do you have a payment and performance bond, you know, for just because it鈥檚 your acquired or This job requires it, your your license requires it, we get that info. Yeah, I鈥檓 going to go after that. I鈥檓 going to file that claim, because your payment bond guarantees the GC is going to pay for labor and materials that they鈥檙e obligated to. I鈥檓 gonna, I鈥檓 gonna go after that insurance companies, which are basically bonding companies, don鈥檛 like that. They鈥檙e like any other type of insurance. I don鈥檛 they don鈥檛 want to pay you, and the GCS rates will go up if that claim goes through. So it gets their attention.
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Thea Dudley听
Small Claims Court, I love small claims court. it is still the wild west of all things. You can use it there. It鈥檚 cheap, it鈥檚 fast. You can get it served. Either in some states you can serve it yourself, and some states you can hire a process server or the sheriff will do it. Definitely worth the money, gets their attention. Easy to dismiss. If you need to, I would say, Don鈥檛 dismiss your court date until you actually have gotten paid, because Been there, done that, and it feels horrible, plus having to go back and refile and get them served again. It鈥檚 just embarrassing and stupid. Just avoid it. Just avoid it where you can. But you know, it鈥檚 low cost, fast and it鈥檚 all DIY civil court, much more expensive, much slower, with the wheels make a friend of a construction law attorney and then get them to do on the cheap A well placed demand letter from that attorney鈥檚 office that sometimes is enough to move somebody off the mark, if nothing else. It irritates them, and they wonder what you鈥檙e up to, and you get a phone call. Nobody cares if I send them a demand letter, it鈥檚 like, oh, she鈥檚 mad. She鈥檚 giving me 10 days. Oh, okay, yeah, 10 days. That鈥檚 just 10 more days that they know I鈥檓 not going to be bugging them. They鈥檙e not going to hear from me. And then at the end of the 10 days, what am I going to do? Give them a sternly worded email or voicemail saying, now come on, you need to pay me. Your 10 days are up. I鈥檓 going to do something. Yeah, I just skip that drama altogether and just go straight to the here鈥檚 the outsource demand letter. I just don鈥檛 care.
听
Thea Dudley听
Now, some things that are not as obvious, that could have avoided us getting ghosted are joint checks. You鈥檝e got somebody that鈥檚 on the spectrum. Let鈥檚 joint check this now. I鈥檝e got a third party. I鈥檝e got whoever is paying them their customer now, now I鈥檝e got that, you know, tri party relationship. I want to make sure I have access to whoever has the purse strings. Hey, dudes not paying me. Says, Oh, I don鈥檛 know what he says, Because he said nothing, because he won鈥檛 call me back. So is there a reason that I鈥檓 not getting paid. Did you cut a check? And, you know, somebody forgot about me? What happened here? So I like joint checks, trust fund statutes, you know, they鈥檙e state specific. They鈥檙e I haven鈥檛 seen them with a huge lot of teeth, but I do like that. There are some hoops you can jump through and put a little more pressure on your customer, because that attached to the trust funds, they鈥檙e supposed to be keeping things separate. You can send that letter out. It gets their attention, mostly because nobody really understands them and they鈥檙e not quite sure. So it鈥檚 a little bit of using fear and ignorance to help collect or get someone鈥檚 attention, or at least get a phone call. I鈥檓 okay with that, plus, if they end up filing bankruptcy, it gives me a valid argument that it should be excluded from the estate, because I went ahead and went after that.
听
Thea Dudley听
Then there鈥檚 the stalker method. I鈥檓 going to call you, text or email daily. I want to make sure you remember that I鈥檓 still there. I鈥檓 going to get with my salesman and drive out to see you. I I love going to a job site. I鈥檝e got some really fun boots that I bought specifically for it, and I鈥檓 going to go out there and I鈥檓 going to confront you on this. I鈥檝e got my salesman with me. Think, dude, I need you to call me, call the owner, call anybody in that company that I think might be able to get me paid. And sometimes you鈥檙e talking to the AP person, and you鈥檙e like, hey, well, you know, what do I got to do to get paid here? And you find out some stuff about the company that you may or may not want, may not want to know. Yeah, but depending on who you reach and how upset they are or look, I have given him your message over and over, we can afford to pay you. He鈥檚 just, he鈥檚 just digging in like a tick on a dog because he doesn鈥檛 like you. He doesn鈥檛 like that. You call all the time, whatever the case may be. But how do I rate with this customer. Do they need me? Will they need me again? And they always need you again? Absolutely, always will need you again. They just sometimes forget that this is how they treated you, because the salesman and them are getting along great. The person who鈥檚 collecting and granting the money, maybe we鈥檙e not in such a great spot. And then there鈥檚 your long shots, you know, am I able to, hey, you know, you don鈥檛 have a lot going on. Why don鈥檛 you assign your accounts receivable to me? I know it鈥檚 a long shot. It鈥檚 happened a couple times for me, not always. And then, you know, is there corporate officer liability? Can I pierce that corporate veil? Can I, you know, get in direct contact and they sign a personal guarantee. What lever Can I pull? Or can I at least throw it out there and make somebody a little bit uncomfortable where it鈥檚 like, Hey, this is what we鈥檙e looking into.
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Thea Dudley听
My point is, you鈥檙e trying to get them to pay attention to you. You鈥檙e not doing anything illegal. You鈥檙e not doing anything you know that that鈥檚, you know, sketchy, but we definitely are trying to raise that awareness, that look you鈥檝e got to ghosting me is not going to get it. I think the number one method for avoiding ghosting and to get paid is the proactivity. The better off. You can check somebody out, the more you can do. You know, knowing your customer, the who, what, why? When Google search them, check their secretary of state, check your trade groups, check their their credit report, all of those things you know, are they willing to sign a PG? Are they willing to do a joint check? Do they care if you secure your lien rights anytime somebody throws up the well, I don鈥檛 want people to think I don鈥檛 pay my bills. Well if you pay your bill, a preliminary or statutory lien notice is not going to be a big deal. It鈥檚 just normal course of business. And you can explain that, if you鈥檙e someone that doesn鈥檛 pay their bill, I can see why your eyebrows are, you know, up on your forehead when you are looking at getting ghosted, anything that you can do that鈥檚 legal. I don鈥檛 mean going out on their Facebook page and calling them a deadbeat, or, you know, going out and leaving a review that says, hey, they鈥檙e great. If they could only figure out how to work a phone in reverse and call me back. Those are, those are not good things. You can get on their website, though, and just go hey and their contact issue. Hey, this is the you know, love to talk to you. Please give me a holler. Keep it very, very light above board. Usually I don鈥檛 get a phone call back, but it does. It does show up. At least somebody in their office is reading it. They鈥檙e like, Who is this woman? Why does she want us to call her back? And sometimes they do, they end up inadvertently calling you back, and you have a conversation with someone who鈥檚 following up on leads that, yeah, doesn鈥檛 really care or want to know you. You want to at least know if you鈥檙e getting ghosted, know you鈥檙e doing business with before you get ghosted. If it happens that you have to back into this, know your remedies and secure them and act quickly. Don鈥檛 let these things linger out there. It goes back to that German philosophy. What was the I鈥檓 not mad that you lied to me. I鈥檓 upset that now I can鈥檛 believe you. It doesn鈥檛 matter what the company is, they will come back around. They will forget that we had this, this ghosting issue, because to them, it鈥檚 a non issue. They鈥檙e like, what I just I was super busy. I couldn鈥檛 get to you the the project was out of control. It鈥檚 like, you know, I just don鈥檛 want to hear it. I don鈥檛 want to hear it. I want you to be a grown up and come to the table and talk to me if you鈥檙e having problems, and let鈥檚 get something situated. I can鈥檛 carry you forever. I didn鈥檛 give birth yet and I didn鈥檛 marry ya. What I need you to do is take care of your account like an adult. And the next time you come up and you say, Hey, I just, why is my order on hold? Well, you treated me like Casper the last time we were we were hanging together, and I just I鈥檓 not into it. I can鈥檛 have more skin in the game than you do
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Speaker 1听
if you have your favorite ghost stick remedy or something that you鈥檝e done that has gotten you paid when you thought, hey, all hope is lost. I鈥檇 love to hear about it. Please send it over to me at thea@creditoverlord.com happy to share it with the other listeners, or, you know, pop it out there in a future column. And that wraps another edition of 麻豆传媒 talks. Credit. We come out every other week on Tuesday, and we are on Apple Spotify and YouTube. Be sure and hit the notifications button. Subscribe and never miss an episode until then, keep watching that AR.
